Display tablet help

[Jojo]

So with christmas approaching I am looking into upgrading from my graphic tablet to a display tablet for drawing (so that I can draw on the screen) and I wanted to ask if you guys have any experience with display tablets. I have already watched  a lot of reviews and even before that I knew that a cintique is not an option because I still need all of my organs.

So I have been mainly looking at Xp-pen and Huion. Originally I thought Huion but for their new tablets the line quality is kinda bad (also read some bad reviews). Also I really, really like the new pen of the Xp-pen 12 (and it is super affordable) but I kinda want to go for something bigger. Maybe the xp-pen artist 22E pro? So yeah...

Do you guys have a display tablet (preferably that is not from Wacom) and some input?

[TheCrazyDragonLady]

I don't personally have any display tablet wisdom, however I don't suggest getting a Huion. Different animators have complained about different problems such as the charging/connection cable dying, software incompatibility ect ect. 

[Jojo]

2 hours ago, TheAlbinoNightfury said:

I don't personally have any display tablet wisdom, however I don't suggest getting a Huion. Different animators have complained about different problems such as the charging/connection cable dying, software incompatibility ect ect. 

Yeah, that's what I heard too but whenever I hear something bad there is a bunch of people saying something good, but I'll keep that in mind

[Markus]

I have some experience with all kind of different tablets and display tablets. Some thoughts:

- Wacom has the best experience from all of them, period. I'm talking about stand-alone display tablets only here (not counting Apple iPad). With experience I mean pen-handling and first and foremost Drivers.

- Wacom are the most expensive of them all, but a second-hand one is way cheaper and might still get a better experience than other brands.

- There are display tablets which use Wacom technology (like the dell canvas or Samsung Android tablets) but they use a very old system and are not equal to the newer Wacom products. If you have the money to spare and can choose between a new (or old) Wacom device and a other-brand device which uses wacom technology, choose the Wacom one (mostly because of drivers)

- I don't have experience with many other pen-types but I used AES technology pens before (those which need batteries). This technology is e.g. used in the Microsoft Surface Tablets and the Lenovo Pen-enables notebooks. They are okay to use and I know people who use them heavily and are happy with them. But compared to the Wacom products, they are inferior in pen handling and again, drivers. (imo)

- I really rave about Wacom here, but this is because I really really dislike hardware and software which does not work as intended and doesn't give me a seamless experience. The main reason why I like them is because they have years of experience making drivers which work seamless with the operating system and you are free to set them up the way you want. This is something which from my experience is the biggest problem I have with the other brands. Even Microsoft, which has their Surface Tablets and Pens and can control the whole pipeline from hardware to software does not get it right. You have to setup several settings before you are able to use the pen properly for painting. As an another anecdote: A lot of people complain about Wacom and drivers not working, especially about 1 year ago in conjunction with Adobe Photoshop. The problem there was, that Windows itself changed a setting behind the scenes with an update and did not inform Wacom about it. So for a few days people went crazy that their product stopped working and had to find solutions for it. Wacom fixed it with a simple toggle in their driver, where you can turn on/off the freehand/windowsInk option (which broke everything), but nowadays when you search, you probably still find all these driver issues first before getting the right answer  

- On the other hand. After using display tablets for a while and normal tablets for much longer, I have to say that I'm not so sure that I prefer the display tablets to work on. I have a 27inch Dell Canvas at home (similar to Wacom Cintiq 27QHD) to work with, but for the time being I prefer a simple Intuos to work with. Especially for painting I prefer the tablets instead of the displays, because the hand is in the way.

- So my advice is: What do you want to use the new device for and what to you already own? Do you want to focus on drawing instead of painting, then a display tablet might be a cool thing. Do you paint more than drawing, maybe a display tablet is not the best thing. Do you want to do it for fun and yourself or for work? If you want to draw a lot just for fun with a bit of coloring, maybe a iPad with Apple Pencil & Procreate is the best thing you can get currently (quality+convenience/price). If you want to work professionally, meaning, a lot of editing with different tools, file sharing with others, etc. then a desktop system might be more useful. If you want to get a display tablet, maybe wait and save a bit to get a second-hand or newer and smaller cintiq and use a intuos for the time being. If you get another brand display tablet, try to find someone/somewhere where you try it first. Or you buy a very very cheap one and then it won't hurt as much if it does not work the way you intended. So go for the cheapest and smallest one might be my guess in this case.

This is only my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt.   Sorry for the long rant  

[Jojo]

1 hour ago, Markus said:

I have some experience with all kind of different tablets and display tablets. Some thoughts:

- Wacom has the best experience from all of them, period. I'm talking about stand-alone display tablets only here (not counting Apple iPad). With experience I mean pen-handling and first and foremost Drivers.

- Wacom are the most expensive of them all, but a second-hand one is way cheaper and might still get a better experience than other brands.

- There are display tablets which use Wacom technology (like the dell canvas or Samsung Android tablets) but they use a very old system and are not equal to the newer Wacom products. If you have the money to spare and can choose between a new (or old) Wacom device and a other-brand device which uses wacom technology, choose the Wacom one (mostly because of drivers)

- I don't have experience with many other pen-types but I used AES technology pens before (those which need batteries). This technology is e.g. used in the Microsoft Surface Tablets and the Lenovo Pen-enables notebooks. They are okay to use and I know people who use them heavily and are happy with them. But compared to the Wacom products, they are inferior in pen handling and again, drivers. (imo)

- I really rave about Wacom here, but this is because I really really dislike hardware and software which does not work as intended and doesn't give me a seamless experience. The main reason why I like them is because they have years of experience making drivers which work seamless with the operating system and you are free to set them up the way you want. This is something which from my experience is the biggest problem I have with the other brands. Even Microsoft, which has their Surface Tablets and Pens and can control the whole pipeline from hardware to software does not get it right. You have to setup several settings before you are able to use the pen properly for painting. As an another anecdote: A lot of people complain about Wacom and drivers not working, especially about 1 year ago in conjunction with Adobe Photoshop. The problem there was, that Windows itself changed a setting behind the scenes with an update and did not inform Wacom about it. So for a few days people went crazy that their product stopped working and had to find solutions for it. Wacom fixed it with a simple toggle in their driver, where you can turn on/off the freehand/windowsInk option (which broke everything), but nowadays when you search, you probably still find all these driver issues first before getting the right answer  

- On the other hand. After using display tablets for a while and normal tablets for much longer, I have to say that I'm not so sure that I prefer the display tablets to work on. I have a 27inch Dell Canvas at home (similar to Wacom Cintiq 27QHD) to work with, but for the time being I prefer a simple Intuos to work with. Especially for painting I prefer the tablets instead of the displays, because the hand is in the way.

- So my advice is: What do you want to use the new device for and what to you already own? Do you want to focus on drawing instead of painting, then a display tablet might be a cool thing. Do you paint more than drawing, maybe a display tablet is not the best thing. Do you want to do it for fun and yourself or for work? If you want to draw a lot just for fun with a bit of coloring, maybe a iPad with Apple Pencil & Procreate is the best thing you can get currently (quality+convenience/price). If you want to work professionally, meaning, a lot of editing with different tools, file sharing with others, etc. then a desktop system might be more useful. If you want to get a display tablet, maybe wait and save a bit to get a second-hand or newer and smaller cintiq and use a intuos for the time being. If you get another brand display tablet, try to find someone/somewhere where you try it first. Or you buy a very very cheap one and then it won't hurt as much if it does not work the way you intended. So go for the cheapest and smallest one might be my guess in this case.

This is only my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt.   Sorry for the long rant  

Thanks for the detailed answer. I am currently (well currently might be a bit stretched as I haven't used it in a few months) using the small intuos draw. I would like to use my new tablet for painting and drawing. The thing is I really don't like how my art turns out with a graphic tablet. Everything is always somewhat crooked because my hand eye coordination doesn't get along with drawing on the tablet and seeing it on screen and it is really frustrating for me to practice when I hate how it feels and usually don't like the outcome. So I don't think buying a bigger Intuos would fix my problem.

I'll be honest here I am not a fan of wacom, yes they are the best but they are absolute assholes on the way they price their products just because the are the brand leader (I mean (and you shall here me rant now^^) the newest cintiqe has a touch option for 500dollars more which doesn't work right, it doesn't have hotkeys (if I remember correctly you have to buy the remote extra), oh and you have to buy the ergo stand thingy (again 500 more) and still costs almost as much as small used up car, oh but yes the drivers work nice and the pen is good. Geez I rather take my car (or a horse for that matter) thanks) (not attacking you just my opinion on wacom)). So I really don't want to buy a cintiq, not even a "cheap" one because the old cintiqes have worse tech sometimes than the newer tablets from other brands (and I mean the old cintique 13 HD is still 800-900 dollar for that I can get the Xp-pen 22E pro and still save about 200 dollar). Still I totally get why people would rather go for a wacom (you know what you get and their tablets usually last a long time, no parallax and pen tilt (no idea what that does ^^), though I had some issues with the drivers myself so I really can't give them points for that XD ... guess I have to apologize for my rant now

I just want to use the new tablet for myself, I really don't think for my hobby that a Cintique is worth it. Choosing the cheapest in case it doesn't work isn't a bad idea

I'll see if I can find a place which sells some other display tablets.

Again Thanks for your detailed answer

[Markus]

No worries, I'm not offended in the slightest. I totally agree with you about the pricing of Wacom products!  

It really is dependent of your budget: If a Xp-pen 22E is about $600 (if I understand that right from your comment), then maybe a iPad Pro 12.9 1st generation is also a viable option. The pen experience there is very very good in my opinion. Of course, you buy into the Apple ecosystem and their pricing model is the same as Wacom ^^'.

I have someone in the office who bought a tablet display from Aliexpress for a very good price. I'll ask him when I see him and forward his opinion.  

[Jojo]

24 minutes ago, Markus said:

No worries, I'm not offended in the slightest. I totally agree with you about the pricing of Wacom products!  

It really is dependent of your budget: If a Xp-pen 22E is about $600 (if I understand that right from your comment), then maybe a iPad Pro 12.9 1st generation is also a viable option. The pen experience there is very very good in my opinion. Of course, you buy into the Apple ecosystem and their pricing model is the same as Wacom ^^'.

I have someone in the office who bought a tablet display from Aliexpress for a very good price. I'll ask him when I see him and forward his opinion.  

I already have an apple phone (though not bought my family usually gets them with our phone contracts) so buying into the apple thing wouldn't be that big an issue, but I agree their pricing is the same as wacom. So yeah not so sure about the Ipad, might be useful but I kinda want shortcut keys for drawing and got super annoyed with the touch on my old tablet. But I'll consider it (might be usefull for the e-book reading as well that I am planning *starts thinking*), I heard that the apple pencil is pretty good for drawing but you have to buy it extra, same for the keyboard sheath (don't even know if every tablet can use this but would love it). Also Ipad won't have desktop apps.

Oh yeah I'd be super interested in the opinion of your co-worker Also glad you weren't offended I guessed you wouldn't be but you can't be careful these days on the internet ^^

[Markus]

So, it appears it was @Roger's tablet, not Claudio's. His opinion: It's really bad and he would not recommend it at all.

Reason:

- Driver issues, especially with OSX.

- The pen is very inaccurate. If you tilt the pen slightly, the cursor appears on another location than the tip.

- The stand is very bad and you can't lay it very flat without removing the stand.

https://www.gaomon.net/ (I think he has a about 17inch variant)

[Jojo]

Yeah, Gaomon is kind a new to this. Thanks